The Challenge All Stars 4: Premiere Week

0:00 N [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] welcome back to the nullified take Channel on YouTube where we've got the TNT takes on the challenge All Star 4 premier week that's right I'm your host Chris and with me today is my fellow co-hosts here for this episode I've got Kahuna on my right hand right hand side my rideal die someone that always comes back every season to talk to me about the challenge and then also angel cake from the angel cake entertainment Channel who's a true

1:21 Veteran a true Pioneer of this game when it comes to talking about the challenge and I'm sure someone that is very excited about so many legendary veterans coming back out of retirement to play this week but I'll start off with Kahuna Guna how have you been it's been a while like we I feel like it's been a whole week and normally we talk about once or twice a week but it's been a slower week because Australian Survivor is no longer on yeah and that's a hard void to feel when we've had such a strong season of aali Survivor but Allstar for stepping in and saying hey like look at this and I'm enjoying it like although I was feeling very high coming in feeling super Loosey Goosey about like the episode because it was so fun the intro and everything just had me smiling right from the get-go now I'm feeling a little bit down right now because I realize this black is just making me look so underdressed next to Drew here making us all look bad like I just feel I'm like oh now I feel B because Drew is outshining everyone look at this man yeah Drew like I mean you look like ready to go on a cruise you look like you're ready to have some holiday party Vibes it's the weather's changing on that side I'm sure it's getting warmer like for us it's the opposite it's getting colder it's winter over here in Australia you know or heading into

2:41 Towards winter how's things on that side it's going great I decided to dress up because this is like a vacation you know this is like a vacation compared to what we just dealt with 39 which could have felt like chores that could have felt like bustling and working this season I've watched I'm gonna be real I watched this episode like five times both episodes five times since it's premiered so I'm coming in I'm excited to be chatting and we're late because of me and I had to get this outfit on so that's my fault everybody we don't rush perfection on this podcast you take all the time you need to get ready for the show I know everybody in the live will definitely appreciate it let's say hello to our live audience we've got Chris back in the live saying a start to the season so far hello to everyone we've also got lovable Nikki we've got kiwi she's back kiwi welcome back to the live as well we've got fa we've got denica in the live so a lot of the familiars Sue here as well Chris of noad nice haircut thank you I appreciate it so we are mixing it up a little bit thank you so much th I like this what's going on is this like compliment Chris for the hair like I should wear a hat less or maybe it was part of my plan I wear a hat so

4:01 Often on this podcast so when I don't everybody takes notice of it and they notice that I still have a head hair it's not like because I feel like a lot of men when they get older they have a hat on because they're losing their hair in my case it's not the case I still have my hair so but yeah Drew George Father Figure Drew George Father Figure George Michaels I could be your father figure hey I'm bringing in the there's a lot of parents on this Allstar season and I'm ready TJ's having a good time everybody's having a good time why can't I have a good time so I've never worn this shirt before but hey I'll wear here I love it I love it and I'm gonna start off with you drew because obviously I know you've been hyped about all star 4 for a very long time you're a true old school fan you've watched some of these old school Seasons multiple times you've spoken about it on your show you've spoken about it on patreon you know you're big into the road rules like for me I don't have that history that you have and some of the true Die Hard old school fans have what was it like watching this sort of episode seeing like Legends like kefla coming back seeing Rachel finally back on the challenge like did it pay off for you seeing them in the intro seeing them in episode one what was the feels did

5:21 You get that Nostalgia I did I thought it was really good I like the beginning intro of seeing everything I didn't like that TJ called it a fifth sport like right off the bat like two seconds in he's like America's fifth sport was born in 1998 I was like no there was a reality TV show that was born but I really loved the intro to like how we got here to this point and then yeah seeing Rachel on here and kind of Tina's impression of the everybody in the Mean Girls Alliance was like spoton and they kind of clicked into place and kefla is just like the sweet heart of the Season starting off he's given the house speech he's the great uncle as he's calling himself self and he's like showing up in both daily challenges and it's awesome to see and yeah Leroy cam is back I mean there's just so much fun and personality here Flora who wasn't shown much on her one Challenge season back in the day is having incredible very minimal but very funny confessionals it's just really great I mean it is like such a breath of fresh air it's almost like the exact opposite of what we went through with 39 it's awesome yeah well I want to go to Kahuna who's like the only father on the podcast out of the three of us he's actually God kids did you live through Flora a little bit when she said hey I don't want to embarrass my daughter coming out here and she told me just don't be the first voted out is

6:41 That the true reason why you don't want to go play any reality tv as well because you want to remain cool in your kids's eyes you know rather than go on there and put your neck on the line you know what like I'll give you a little bit of really sweet what it's like to think as a father right and I'll try to be quick is that your constantly like having these exactly Waring sentiments all the time I want my kids to stay this age forever but I really want to see everything they grow up to be and how amazing they are and all at the same time you have these emotions right like sometimes like I love them more than anything in the world but they actually piss me off more than anything right these Waring constant battles right so I also have a thing with my daughter where I definitely want her to think I'm cool but I really love embarrassing her also like that Waring that Waring sentiment there so I don't know like I'd be okay either way because yeah like that is are you gonna be that Dad when you drop off in front of school you're gonna be like love you honey right in front of like all our friends yeah playing like very inappropriate music loudly that kind of thing yeah what was it like for you I know you're also an older School fan compared to myself you watched some of these earlier Seasons how did you

8:01 Feel seeing all of these different sort of old school players coming back they did explain a little bit of the past history I obviously came into this knowing that Rachel Tina Veronica they're very close friends but they do throughout this episode I think they did a lot of effort into showing flashbacks of previous Seasons trying to give a backstory because obviously they've had the Challenge USA on Paramount before that's probably brought in a whole new fandom to the challenge that have also started coming in like myself so they have to balance the you know telling the story but also explaining who some of these people are probably to a completely new audience do you feel like they got that balance right here in the opening episodes no that's the one thing I do have because I'm loving seeing this like kefla has not been on since probably some competitors on the flagship show like were born like some people might be not born when Kea was last on this show right there's a lot of history there and a long time has come and I and how many seasons now have we had the episode zero format where we get the pre-season I think it's at least two right maybe three and then have this one where I feel like we should have just had an episode where we get to know catch up with what these people are doing and where they've been

9:21 And like there's so much that we could have gone through that we didn't get because I think in the in the runtime we got like the first challenge about 15 minutes in and there's 24 people that we haven't seen in like nearly 30 years for like 25 years for Kea like I think for them to get anything was important they got a little they got a one minute 30 second like he's what they've been doing kind of thing and obviously KY gets a little bit more focused but I do think we could have at least had the preseason stuff to kind of get that story to kind of get like you said there's a lot of new challenges there but I overall I loved it like that's why one thing I think it would have been nice to know a bit more about what they've been up to and where they've been and what makes a 53y old man like decide to come back on a show like this after all this time why did he not come back after one season and winning and then disappearing for like it's like that's like a movie level script you know what I mean like oh my God was up to did he did he join did he join the FBI the CIA like yeah exactly like there's so much that could have been done there so that's one disappoint but that's a negative I did love everything else about it the stupid like Quinton Tarantino font for the and the nicknames they gave and the intros and the music has been phenomenal

10:41 Like one thing that has taught me is I'm obviously we know now they made the right decision in swapping the air the like 39 in this like imagine coming from that into 39 yeah ready for 40 like you would have just been like so down on 39 at least this way we now have 39 G done and we're enjoying Allstar for to then hopefully have an amazing 40 that I think that they probably made the right decision in holding this back kind of kind of controversial on maybe that point because you mentioned that you would have liked to have seen more about what they did since they went onto the original seasons of The Challenge as a newer School fan who didn't know kefla coming into this I thought we got the right amount of kefla the right amount of backstory because I want to get straight into the game I'm similar to Kiwi maybe kiwi is yeah and maybe kiwi is similar to me I don't know kiwi you can tell us if you're a day one fan or not everybody enjoys these shows a little bit differently I don't normally like those episodes before the actual show I want to get straight into the strategy straight into playing the game straight into the challenges and things like that but that's just how I like to digest it I understand that there's probably like a whole pocket of people that really love like Old School Road Ru Seasons would like to know

12:01 More about it and maybe there is an opportunity for it but I feel like it's the way that paraman sort of packaged their episodes it's like very fixed we've got 12 episodes or we've got x amount of episodes that we need to get through and I think if you want to keep on to the newer fanbase who don't know all of the backstory you probably need to balance that out and get into the action as quickly as you can and I felt like the person who got the biggest intro of all it's got to be Cara Maria right Chris said that it's been a while since Chris you know the restrain of not mentioning Maria for so long we 10 minutes into this podcast no one's spoken about her so I feel like both Kahuna and Angel K kind of set me up they wanted me to talk about karia they didn't want to bring it up but listen carar is coming in she's getting a warm welcome from TJ she's getting Tina saying that this girl's a beast she's somebody that needs to be looked out for she has one of the best episodes you could possibly have coming into this and absolutely dominates it feels like Angel C she's never left like is there any way that karia can go onto a season these days and not make a final because if she's looking this good after not having played for so long I'm fearful for people on season 40 because we know I don't know what happens when she gets there she's on season 40 so you know and she's starting very well here in Allstars

13:22 Yeah it's actually really impressive because I mean you see how difficult this first daily challenge was I mean I mean it's not anything like too over complicated but just the execution of it is so difficult with the incline with how hot it was I mean we saw people laying on the ground Brad's drinking so much water just to stay hydrated people are complaining about the heat yet it didn't even look like Cara was really even sweating it looked like she was glistening in the Sun as she was just like going from puzzle box to puzzle box to puzzle box and to get not just first place for the women but first place overall it's incredible I just really like you come into this game expecting her to like Beast it out at least get into the top three get the star after TJ announces how the twist is and the stars are but to come in first overall and to show like and then have TJ in the background hyping her up being like there she is she's back it was awesome it was really fun to see TJ was like Cara's hyp man throughout this whole episode and you can tell how much TJ loves Cara because even when she came into season 39 as a champion he was like the intro she got was phenomenal even in that so I really enjoyed seeing her back but the thing that impressed me the most kuna is karia we know she's physically like let's okay to be fair she sucks at math

14:42 We all know that again in these two episodes she sucked at math and it's a really like if she it would have been unfair if she could do math I reckon she would have been equal to bananas and C probably for challenge ons like I'll put it out there that's maybe like the one weakness she has that kind of keeps her back but despite that she's won championships before and she's won a solo championship against me especially knowing the theme of this season being that you're going to have to beat the men to win at the end if you're a female and there's a lot of reference to that with Rachel saying a woman's going to win and you know K Maria coming back having done it before they kind of throw those hints out there that it's possible and they want people to believe that it is possible and she probably can do it but the thing that impressed me the most Kahuna is how good she is in the political game like once again comes in she wins a star not knowing the consequences of winning that star she's going to have to play defense this whole season but she's in different Pockets talking to different people and showing us why she really is a social sort of great player of this game as well she's got the physical side but she's also got that social side that I think is going to play dividence this season for her yeah Kara Maria is the goat like it's female goat for me she's the greatest to ever play the game and to have her back in our screens was amazing we go GL of T right of Tori

16:03 Yeah well she is like I think they did a diservice to the show keeping away for so long but at least when we get it back we have that like that massive flush of dopamine here to just have the Nostalgia and the impress impressiveness and just having it back is phenomenal I do want to temper my expectations a little bit for K Maria especially in 40 I think when you said like as you were saying that it just kind of clicked in my head as a thought and maybe it's a little bit too far and a little bit too cynical of okuna here but I get the I get the feeling that may looking at the men's side and how when we were drafting we were like it's Brad who you know and then we re Brad and Leroy and then outside of that we were like oh maybe they're setting up on a platter for Leroy to finally get a win I think maybe they're setting it up on a platter for a female to finally get another solo win like this for any season where K Maria can win straight out against men this is the season when you look at who she's facing off against on the men's side you know what I mean like so I'm wondering if they actually did kind of set it up so that we could have a female winner again especially when you're saying in the edit we're getting Rachel saying it early we're seeing K Maria look impressive already beating the men in episode one I'm thinking

17:23 Maybe like that's what they actually engineer it that way I'm enough from some of the men to say that like I wouldn't completely count all of them out but no not at all but if they were like set casting the season we want to do it this way what's the best like you know how can we kind of make it as light as possible had stuff like I honestly feel like foil had stuff you know next thing we know you've been spending too much time with maky who's a co-host on Australian survival of ours and he believes has been podcast about you know Bigfoot and all these like urban legends and I feel like kuna you've gone down too far down the rabbit hole with him on this stuff camera the red strings yeah no listen I personally I personally think that it's going to be a very solid season like I mean we've got Tony time back Drew Tony time's looking fit and a big part of Tony time sort of opening moments here you can tell that the producers love this new Tony a more mature Tony he's now a dad he's going out there playing trying to make some money for his family we get the backstory about you know the hurricane and hurricanes that happened and all of that

18:43 So you know really to me I feel like Tony's also being set up as someone that could be a very big character this season that we're going to get behind because the edit is really focusing on him on him and we also know that he potentially may be returning in the future for more seasons so I feel like he must have a good run out there and looking in shape so I wouldn't count him out like he's looking potentially Kahuna getting Tony and karia in his team he's got two solid first picks in my mind yeah I mean Tony is looking good I think that first daily challenge I don't know it kind of like threw me off a bit because I feel like it was really great for car Maria and then Rachel gets into the top three which I thought was like okay that's fine and then Avery even gets in there above Rachel and it's kind of like yeah like how did Avery get day like I think she was shocked with Laurel with Nicole like hanging around and stuff it's like okay well that's a little shocking but also not necessarily at the same time knowing like Avery is younger in there and she's looks to be in great shape I thought the guys were very surprising I guess not so much Brad getting first but like Leroy being in the loser group I mean that was the biggest shock of the first day like I don't know if it was just like Panic if it was the Heat or what but like knowing Leroy and seeing his like Instagram stories and how much he worked out it was just like surprising he

20:04 He got all the way to the loser group Laurel was down for the women and then Tony also was like in the middle group as well so it's like not like we talked about the guys being a little bit unpredictable I felt like that first challenge kind of showed how unpredictable this game can be especially on the men's side where it's like okay I have no clue where like it depends on what daily I guess and how it's going to go I thought the second daily was a little bit more of like everything settling in and people maybe not being as like frantic for it not being the first daily challenge but yeah that first challenge kind of threw me off a little bit with the results yeah I mean listen I there was no one more nervous than me seeing Leroy at the bottom and I'm like damn like I mean I went all in I went I put it all on Leroy going into the draft like I mean I knew I wasn't going to get the woman that I wanted so I had to make my mail pick count and even him coming in and saying like listen he's part of this power couple you know he's now worked on a lot of things like the second episode was a lot better seeing him kill the math which was basic granted basic math but still seeing him working on things that maybe in the past wouldn't have been his strongest sort of aspect of his game that to me gives me Sort of hope that Leroy could still come in and do extremely

21:24 Well this season and again I mean Leroy being in the bottom got to talk about it having Queen cam back having killer cam back Kahuna like she's force to be reckoned with like she's coming into this game not necessarily in fighting shape not necessarily at the peak of her physical prowers when she previously played this game but she has not skipped the beat or missed the beat when it comes to her Aura around her and her social game because people were shitless like was scared they did not want to put Leroy in like just by her saying hey you stay from Leroy her words had an effect on everybody and they actually followed through I was like this is insane to witness because a lot of these people have never played with Cam but they were still scared of her and she's not even at the top of her physical abilities right now like how awesome is it to see cam back on our screens playing with Leroy isn't it fascinating that we get the contrast in episode one and two where Avery with Cam is like that is scary I don't want to mess with that and then in episode two Tina's like hey threat threaten and she's like n like the aura that you talked about was not there for tetin at all like she's got Rachel and Veronica in the room but all cam had to say was please don't vot vote Leroy and everyone was like you got it cam whatever

22:44 You want not gonna go against that but yeah that is a phenomenal like social Power to have in a game where it's all about alliances because we saw like Leroy was saved by alliances was saved by Alliance which meant Steve was going in but and that's what it comes down to not only do you have to win the physical but you have to have the alliances in the social and the political and we see we've already mentioned Cara using a political prowers to protect the star and then cam just by sheer reputation Alone can have a the political powers to protect lero it's impressive you to B get here says that on the challenge podcast both Cam and Leroy said that they did not work out before allst Stars 4 so I don't know how much time they had before all star 4 known that they were gonna go out there and play eight months after giving birth yeah like yeah and lero is a fulltime like he's got his own business he's like a barber now you know like I mean so the most workout that he does is with his hands and we all know that you know he's not going to be doing the same type of hand jobs that Steve would be doing out there right so like and that's not gonna be that's not gonna be the thing that's gonna get him across the across the board it was it was funny someone

24:04 Else in the comment section actually left this comment and I forgot to bring it up earlier but they said it was funny to see how Steve the first thing that he noticed was the size of T's hands it was like one of the first comments he made when he got on to the show immediately and the producers had the most fun with it like they almost overplayed it to a certain degree on this episode here Drew but Steve also coming back into this I kind of forgot that he was knocked over by Tech like how embarrassing like Tech running over you in an elimination like Tech's no slouch but still like you look at the two like Shane Steve's not really the most I don't feel like he's the most physical guy out there really when it comes to it right but definitely we show he showed some smarts at least in this first two episodes I mean that's the only thing I really remembered from Steve is that he won the trivia and then he got knocked on his butt by Tech and that's why I did have him very high in the rankings when we were doing the draft and everything but he came out and played I mean he showed that he had a focus on wanting to compete he came in with some funny confessionals and then he was able to get the job done when it came to the elimination and I was pretty impressed by Steve as well as somebody else that he was a castmate with on his Road rule season as well as his first Challenge season on The Gauntlet

25:24 Is Adam we didn't talk about him and his performance but being 18 season 18 years away from The Challenge and he gets second place for the men was really solid and now that Steve and Adam have stars and they're going to be looking out for each other that's pretty solid stuff I feel like personally looking back at the draft which I'll bring up here for a second again like getting Adam in that last spot may be the pick of the Season at this point based of the first two episodes like he came into this you know like said not having played the game for a very long time already has a star did extremely well on the first day started making those connections and I wasn't aware of some of the connections that he already had with the Rachels The Veronicas and the tinas of this world and things like that so maybe there's a little bit of runway for him here and a lot of people are looking at him as like yeah he won a star but he's not truly a threat to win it at the end like he hasn't played for so long like you said a lot of people are not aware of what he did when he actually did compete back in the day there's only a few people were around and I mean when you've got players like you know Nicole coming in I can't remember if it was Nicole or Lauren asking you know who's friends with who from the previous Allstar Seasons you know that these players don't watch other challenge Seasons if they're not on it they're not going to go back and watch Adam's

26:45 Season most likely so probably kuna I feel like I picked Adam in a in a good spot here like he was one of the last picks I feel like he could have Blue Chip Pick really it's a considering it was the last pick yeah that's it's pretty impressive you know like to have that but that's one of the things about why I love the draft as well is like how could you even know that like what can you compare 18 years away from the game to like how do you even make an assessment and I did like that because he was in the elimination and in the loser group the fact that Steve got a little bit of confessional points because you know what I'm really annoyed at guys I'm so PTSD I'm like just watching for Ace constantly is Ace going to be what's Ace doing because I'm in your head I'm in your head you're like I see Ace I didn't see I'm like where's Ace's he's even he's not even on the show where's the edit give him a confessional give me Ace like and I don't even like him and now I'm like watching and rooting for him the whole time especially because you know cus is coming in at some point so you're like if somebody's not getting screen time you're like is this the person who's left cuz you know how they do it to you the person will leave a day ago and there'll be a flashback oh by the way so and so left because of this reason and now suddenly you've

28:05 Got Cyrus in the game you know so yeah I get what you're saying and Ace didn't really get a lot of air time early on here at all only stuff that he got was that he was friends with Janelle who was leaving so then he doesn't even have that going forward I'm like so in the first episode when we're supposed to get to know everybody only two people got zero confessionals and that was Ace and Janelle and yeah and Ace only got three confessionals in the second episode so yeah he's not the thing is that when you're going to see a lot of Ace like especially in the beginning of an episode that's like a Telltale sign that he's going to be either in a winning group or going into elimination during that during that episode because if you're not being even highlighted at all like at least Flora is getting some confessionals here and there because they're just funny even though she doesn't have anything to do with the actual episode you know like oh she could just pop up from time to time but with Ace if he gets like two confessionals in like the first five minutes it's like it should set alarm bells for everybody thinking I don't want to give that spoilers but that's just how you read the edit especially with people that don't get any confessionals at all at this point so 100% true okay so we do we do get obviously here in this first episode we get stepen Tyree kind

29:25 Of on the outs right they both don't have the connections to keep them safe in the game we always knew that was going to be one of the things because you're going up against Derek you're going up against Leroy Derek has got connections in the game it was interesting to see how obviously people went out Ryan specifically went out to really bat for him and try and keep him safe you've got cam working really hard to keep the likes of Leroy safe in the game so it really was an Easy Choice by the end of this I do respect the fact that Ace was like I'm a man of my own I'm going to be voting where I want to vote probably great for his game againa the fact that he's willing to just vote wherever he wants to vote he's in the outs already as well but you know at least he stood by his Man Steve early on here someone that he would like to see stay in the game and then ultimately we've got Tye and Steve going up against each other and Drew it's kind of heartbreaking seeing Ty's story like I don't know the guy from back in the day but I know his history it's one of the reasons why on our other draft we had the sabotage round I threw Tyree at Chantel and it had the biggest reaction and the Li in the even with us doing the actual draft you know but it's kind of sad to see someone constantly fall back into the same habits of going in early and this time probably it wasn't his own fault because Ty actually looked like he grew quite a bit like he's like I've got my Tempo under control now I want to

30:45 Play a good game even TJ wants him to come back and play the game but he can't find himself outside of that first round elimination early elimination sort of rounds and he's not really great at eliminations it looked like he could but then got out smarted by Steve in the end yeah and that was the tough part it was like 11 balls to at least this is what the edit showed 11 balls to Steve seven and you just you could tell like people were rooting for him I mean Laurel was trying to like point out balls and Brandon was getting excited that he could possibly get his first elimination win and coming into this game I think he mentioned a whole bunch of people that he was working with like cam Leroy Brandon and everybody and it's like I felt like Tyrie it was coming in with the best like supporting like that he's ever had in his ever challenged career but then again back in the day we really didn't get to see too much of him because he would get thrown in early and then get eliminated early so he wouldn't get like the edit or anything like we did now I mean I think they really did a good job highlighting him and like letting us see some of his backstory and seeing like what he's been up to since the challenge or since his last appearance on the challenge and I was like this is the most we've seen of him and when I when we finally got to hear about his character and just him in general I was

32:05 Like I really want to see him do well I want him to like at least make it past the first episode and seeing him in the elimination it's like a man he just can't catch a break and then he gets up and it's you kind of get excited and then it just completely falls apart with Steve's like Steve squirrel strategy I could not tell you like going into there I'm like there's no Str to this you're just finding balls and running out and putting in thing somehow there is a strategy and it just worked out for Steve in the end again congratulations to Steve but I really did feel for Tyrie and hearing TJ be so like bummed that Tyrie had to leave and was eliminated it just showed like tyree's just a good guy and he's made a mark on people and is a good friend to people and I feel like we could at least see him one more time like Allstar 5 if he gets asked I'm sure he would he would say yes and I'm sure that they would do like a Redemption maybe kind of vibe to him so I think I think that we could see him at least one more time yeah I would second that I would love to see tar come back because I'm a sucker for you know like the Underdog battler Story like someone that's just been battered and that constantly gets themselves back up dust themselves off and get back on the horse and try and actually you know make it work so for me I'd love to see

33:25 Tyreek come back and at least give it another go the one thing I will say if we could be critical about anything and it sounds like they didn't have much time to prepare a lot of them didn't know that they were coming in but Tyree correct me if I'm wrong he's like a personal trainer he owns a gym and things like that he probably worked too much on like his strength and not so much like he didn't look like shap cardio and if you look at that first challenge because we all love the fact that you know or I do in any case I love it when whoever's at the bottom there's consequences to it in a daily because it makes people push harder so him just you know his social game may have been he would have had all these alliance members but by him not being physically fit enough running up the hill and back down and I think it's a lot harder than what we could probably even Envision watching it on our couches comfortable having our Mountain Dew or our Coke you know while we're watching our Coke Zero for those that are sugar conscious you know like well we're sitting there and we're having a look at the challenge taking place we don't fully appreciate it's running uphill and back down so it's probably killing a lot of people and it's probably where someone like Leroy who said he didn't train much coming in maybe cardio wise that's something that c caught him off guard as well and the reason I think that K killed it is because she does CrossFit all the time so like CrossFit you're going to have to have like some stamina and some endurance which is clearly why she was able to you know she was like I think like stations ahead of the second person

34:45 Basically doing that but coming back to Tyree I think that's the one thing I will say like if he's in the mix or in the running for coming back for another season he needs to work on that cardio side of it and I think if he can do that he'll come back he'll well but it was definitely unfortunate to see him go here so early before he really had an opportunity to do much in the game did you have any final thoughts on Tyreek ker did you like seeing him yeah I felt the same that he probably was in the best position to actually do something in the game and to go out first is such a like ironic like it's funny in that regard but sad funny I was surprised at how hard TJ gave him the endorsement like farewell like it wasn't like he was like I really hope to see you again producers like you know putting his thumb on the scale a little bit there but I was impressed by that I the one thing that I really I'm going to put the comment up as well like that was one of the moments like I like to see that his daughter was named his named DM I was like yeah there was a couple moments where I went a like during the show was when Leroy had his little in the intro he was walking on and you hear TJ's voiceover say and I'm so happy to see my man Leroy I was like me too

36:05 And then that moment to see that t named his daughter DM I was like a that's really nice because my last name is brown and I was if I had another daughter we were thinking about maybe DM Brown except my wife was like I don't want to name after someone on The Challenge I just like the name but yeah so that could have been a thing to see that he did that was ni yeah definitely is and a big part of the first two episodes and we haven't spoken about this at all but I feel like there's so much that we can dive into here obviously Laurel comes back Nicole is back Drew the first two episodes like it was a bit uncomfortable to watch at times to be honest seeing them having to like move past each other not interact clearly knowing that Laurel still has feelings for Nicole and Nicole know this as well makes it very uncomfortable for me to watch and I feel like Dar I feel like this season is it's not going to age well for Laurel it's not going to look good on her either what's your thoughts on this whole situation like seeing both of them there it's kind of I was excited to see some of the drama but now that I'm seeing it on my screen I'm like yeah I don't really want to almost don't want to watch it like between them to be honest yeah I we've kind of been through this like kind of song

37:25 And dance before especially if you watch X on the beach peak of Love and it's I don't know it somebody in my Discord for the patreon was like what's more cringe is it the Nicole and Laurel stuff on this season or is it like Jordan and Tory on Ryder dies but I would say that Jordan Tor on Ryder dies was the first season that they had done together since they had broken up so I mean I felt like that was like a little bit of a catharsis whereas Laurel and Nicole we've seen this we've been around this it never ends well and it's not going to end well because this is a year later and we've seen how it all ends and I agree with you I think that it could have been I it wouldn't be as messy but I think it would have been just as fine if we just had car and Laurel on the season hadn't been on the season together since 34 it was really tumultuous between them and just let that kind of storyline kind of play out and see where that goes we don't really need to add Nicole into the mix and I just don't think we need we I don't think we needed it I don't want to see it we're going to see it's going to it's going to be really tough at C certain points it's gonna be bombastic in certain points and yeah we need drama but I don't think we need the level of drama or a drama

38:45 That like is rooted in deep personal stuff in my opinion gross yeah Dan here says a lot of people agree with you in the live Danica say I'm not looking forward to the Laurel and Nicole drama I'm just over it a lot of people sort of agree with that what was it like for you kuna watching this all sort of unfold in front of us like you know I like there was this part of me was like I don't like it but I know I'm like I'm counting them points for the draft I will say but I'm counting it at the expense of Laurel and I don't really like it as well like I feel kind of like dirty like I've sold my soul to the devil picking Nicole now you're kind of more toxic than Nico remor bias remorse no like there are there are versions right when you can like you can build an entire season around the awkwardness and tension of ex's but when it's like they've done it like that's they it's the theme about it but these two like it crosses a line when it's just you know it's toxic and you know it's like when you feel it's beyond the game it's well beyond the game it's like it's bad people doing bad things to each other and when as much as I think Laurel is a

40:06 Phenomenal competitor when she's coming off as the good person it's not a great it's not a great look you know what I mean that means Nicole in this situation at least in this pairing has done so much shitty things to her like it you hate seeing her being subjected to that like it's like it's on the produ like you the producers to put someone in a position where they're basically with an abuser like in a an emotional not physical definitely but yeah Nicole has something over this woman and I don't know how I don't know what it is because if I ever heard her talk in real life it's just like nails down a chalkboard and she would eat all my peanut butter so I'd be pissed off at her constantly I don't know how anyone could be around her but she seems to just have some her claws in this woman who is like she said she's a powerful beautiful woman and Nicole can just turn her to Mud the entire time and that's not comfortable to see that's not a good thing to watch you know what I mean to have someone reduced to a mess just by being around her like I don't know what she did to her like what trauma she inflicted on her to have her be so like clearly affected by this woman and we get we have to watch it

41:27 It's kind of strange cuz I will be honest everybody knows this like when it comes to Laurel I'm not her biggest fan like I don't necessarily like Laurel all that much like I know there's a lot I know a lot of people are going to be like how dare you she's one of the queens and she is I'm not taking any of her reputation away from The Challenge as a competitor there's something about her personality that kind of grinds me a lot of the times when I see her on my screen but I don't want to see her being treated in this way or being in this you know like you said toxic relationship or feel like she can't get away from almost like the person who's abusing like mentally at all but I do age with Chris's com here even though what Nicole doing is bad I think Nicole's com about you know her acting she's 37 year old but she's acting like a child sometimes I think that's the thing that annoys me about Laurel five yeah she there is this thing about her personality where I'm just like I just don't get it but it's a strange relationship I don't really like talking about it I do want to move on from it but before I guess I move on from it Lena does make a very valid point here she says that you know let's not forget Kara's also in there so they didn't just they didn't just put Nicole and Laurel in there they also put Kara Maria in there who we know Nicole kind of had like she crushed on her before she did on Laurel so I feel like that all is done very on purpose and it's going to be interesting to see how that relationship unfolds

42:47 I do want to say one last thing before this if anybody wants a little bit more backstory on all this stuff it is I'm not trying to self-promote or plug or anything but it is like in one part of the car Maria docu series I made when we get to the invasion of the champion stuff and there was that love triangle between Cara Laurel and Nicole I go into like a little bit in depth with the Nicole and Laurel stuff not like super in- depth and go into their own story but there's a there's a reason that Laurel and Nicole kind of like or Laurel has this like thing with Nicole and how tough it has been on her and I'll just say love makes us do crazy things but also Sudani I think said it correctly in saying that Nicole is a Serial cheater and all that time keeps on trying to get back with Laurel and knowing that maybe Laurel is trying to be this like big strong tough person because of stuff that happened in her personal life I'm not going to get too deep into it but again it's in the docu series if anybody wants to get a little bit more into the mindset of everything but there's the there's stuff that happened and then it shapes you and you try to put on this Persona or this thing of like I am stronger I am

44:07 I'm steel and then there's people that can cut through you or you let in and then it's kind of tough to be like okay this person that I finally let in did all this bad stuff to me but also still says that they love me and want to be with me and I want to be with them because of the idea and everything and then it just gets kind of molded around even the strongest of people or what we assume is the strongest of people can be hurt by words and all that stuff so I just I just think that it's so complicated with Laurel and I think we all look at her and go she could absolutely destroy we've seen her put Cara in a headlock and balls in invasion of the Champions and carry her like a baby outside the ring and it's like there's nothing that can defeat her but it can be some stuff that kind of takes you down but yeah and she's a like I mean it's one of the things where even though I'm not the biggest fan of her like she adds a lot of value to the show and it's always the complex personalities are the ones that are the most interesting to observe as a viewer because you're like trying to get into their head you're trying to figure out what the motivations are but like I said this is a little bit of a strange one her relationship with Cara Maria is one that I'm more invested in compared to her Nicole like I want to see them kind of squash the beef to a degree and become friends again but again I don't know if Laurel knows to be a friend

45:27 To K Maria and especially since K Maria has become very that's another thing as well probably a topic for a completely different podcast but the one thing that really annoyed me is that when Kara Maria became stronger as an individual and she started sticking up for herself and things like that and she didn't need Laurel to fighter battles is when Laurel became very toxic to Kara Maria and I think that's the thing that annoyed me back in the day because suddenly Laurel wasn't needed to fight the battles for K Maria and car Maria had her own opinions and takes and Laurel didn't like it so it's going to be interesting to see sort of what happens with that relationship a couple of comments I'll bring up just before we move on from the topic YouTube said Nicole is so toxic and she enjoys doing it to Laurel it's a little sick totally agree kiwi says agree Chris on Laurel Alise says same Chris her personality is abrasive sometimes Laurel has always been a mean girl definitely and I think like we all say like there's definitely things about Laurel that we don't like but we also don't like seeing someone like you know abusing her in the way that Nicole is like mentally like I just don't I don't like seeing that either then saying Laurel is dominant physical player but her social game sucks when she lost my respect when she was fat shaming Big Easy in the hot tub never got it back yeah so she's definitely done some things in the past that's not been great either lefl saying this is perhaps exactly what Laurel needs to overcome Nicole's shackles to see herself the way we see it on TV

46:48 100% agree and then Sudani says plug yourself angel cake your car documentary was amazing I agree very good like anything that angel does for those like would be shocked if you're on this podcast listening to the challenge most of the time people come to this channel from your channel Drew but if someone just met Drew for the first time and it's possible that you've come to this podcast definitely go check out angel cake entertainment's Channel because there in my opinion is no one that does more work for the community when it comes to challenge content on YouTube and we always thank you Angel cake for all the effort that you put into it I know it's a lot of hard work we simply on this channel hit record and talk about the show for an hour you actually have to do some edit some research like there's a lot of thought that goes into it and yeah definitely MTV and Paramount or the production team should look at you know using more of your content in the future shout out if any of them are listening get angel cake on the team because clearly your passion is there for it we really appreciate it so yeah so I guess moving on and it's a difficult one to segue from let's move on to the other very interesting part of the first two episodes aana like Ayana is back and it was not enough Kahuna that she had her salad moment last season like this the last time she was on she had you know eating the Greek salad or whatever salad it was moment which was big TV we talked about it other reality

48:08 TV shows contestants tweeted about it and how great of a TV moment it was aana lives for the drama and she turned it up next level this season and I want to give a shout out to her before we talk about the psychotic gameplay that she brought to the show she's in shape she's looking good looking good coming into the season probably the best shape we've seen her in an Allstar season so like I feel like she could do some damage even if somebody does throw her into an elimination because we know she's not going to be easily beaten in an elimination either but what did you think about this whole Janelle Ayana you know beef that Ayana kind of manufactured or like I don't know she was like taking a lighter to gasoline when it came to actually this whole episode that was that was weird that was like I don't I appreci I not appreciated I didn't really get the you know that doing that to Janelle because she asked like the whole thing of like you are going to ask something for me you better give something back like that was a weird concept like and I but I didn't mind the fact that she's throwing out little things here and there to cast them doubt and maybe like that's part of the game you know like that's very strategy Survivor but there's like a

49:28 Line or a point where like not only is it not working or silly to do and make you look bad but also just becomes a really horrible thing to do as a person and she like I don't mind her like I don't mind her like tripling down on the move but you know the weirdest thing for me was when they had the conversation by the couches and before yeah that before the nomination before the nomination where Janelle comes in there to the house and says I didn't say and A's like see this is what she does she always cries she the victim and then she walks away dancing I'm like what are you doing like you're so obvious that you're that you're playing up for the camera she's dancing in front of the housemates that she's just lied to like clearly anybody with a little bit of emotional intelligence would know she's putting on a show like it was just so bizarre to me but like I agree with you like the initial move is good but she like she went triple quadruple down on the move basically like when she's literally screaming and crying she then uses that to like at that point you just like quiet like you've you've laid your trap let it kind of if Janelle looks bad okay that's what you wanted right but she just wanted to like jump on her and just completely stomp on her when she's

50:48 Already showing like I don't know if she can read body language at all but she was like not okay and she just kept like pouring more fuel on that and that's yeah it's toxic as hell like I sound like such a snowflake cuz I'm focusing on the toxic Behavior but it was just too much like I was like and apparently we have heard in context as well that there was a lot more said that the editors did not show us that went down a very bad path because of Janelle's being half her interracial husband like Ayan threw some bad stuff out there yeah this according to some of the other challenges like Jasmine and stuff like there was some stuff left on the editing floor that would have made her look even worse so yeah well nothing has been confirmed by it there's like the te accounts have said it and a lot of the challengers I think Darren said it in the in the chat but I had my patreon was scouting like going through every podcast the Leroy cam patreon the Jimmy stuff and everything like everybody has said it is worse than what was shown that we did not get any like as much as it was but there's a lot of speculation of what was being said there is some rumors

52:08 That she was Ayanna had not just been fighting with Janelle but like cam Leroy Brandon as well like a lot of other people there's a lot of things being said but it seems like the challengers aren't allowed to speak lovable Nikki posted in my patreon Discord about like Genesis made a comment on Instagram saying like hey I almost was brought in because of the situation I don't know how much I'm allowed to say Janelle replied to somebody who said hey you need to get up and say your piece I would love to hear your side and she's like I'm only I'm so limited in what I can actually say about this cam Leroy who was a part of it but is not giving out very many details so I mean it's very interesting that it seems like everybody signed an NDA or is very like contractually like obligated to not say anything and has to be like silen about at least certain details I mean Jimmy reached out to both Jasmine and Janelle and said that she spoke with both of them yet did not go into detail about anything and Jimmy's not even on this season or she could have said that she could have not named them and said whatever but they're not even saying anything because they don't want it to come back to them that's how serious

53:29 It seems like this stuff is and it's just I don't know it's just so wild we are missing a lot of context but yeah it just knowing that it went beyond game it's not just what it showed in the edit of like oh she said she wanted Jasmine and it's like no I didn't and then I'm gonna quit because I didn't say I wanted to go against Jasmine there's so much more that went on that's like it's crazy it's crazy not to be able to hear all that and I'm with kiwi on this because to me immediately it was so bizarre that Janelle quit like I mean this is the same woman a couple of seasons ago that had a back that was killing her and she still went through the show she still competed like you know in a final and nearly won the final a lot of people believe she should have won the final and she came into the season so confident and saying like hey I'll go up against anyone I'll I don't care I want to get the star I'm here to win if I'm you know if I don't have the star I'd drive a go early you know like it was a bizarre the way that it was edited and didn't realize because again my week you know unfortunately in one of those jobs that you know I work pretty long hours of the week so I don't get to spend too much time on social media to see a lot of these extra things and I'm always afraid when it comes to the challenge things get spoiled very easily and I hate being spoiled on the season so I try and stay away from it as much as I can throughout a season but seriously upsetting

54:49 To hear that because yeah I didn't realize it went to that degree but you could just tell like something with fana like I feel like there's something wrong there like I said that moment using the tears dancing you know for Leroy to get upset in the nomination speech like I mean Leroy is like it takes a lot it takes a lot to get Leroy yeah like if someone did that I'd be like she's not like what are you doing like what is happening right now there's clearly something wrong with this person to sit there and just talk nonsense and gibberish for 45 minutes they said like I when they do the montages of that and they do the little like how it kind of phases in and out so you laugh at how long it is but then when you go oh no she subed them to just a rant for an hour or whatever like that is infuriating like how do you like there's something wrong with a person to just do that nonstop like how do you even come up with stuff the three the an hour what was funny as Leroy saying the cameraman was looking at him for like help the cameraman's like please stop this like we want to stop filming like Leroy like stood up and he's like this is done I'm done with this you know let's move on like so bizarre Drew like the W like even yeah like car was it car Mario who said like I've never been in

56:09 Like a nomination ceremony like this in my life and she's been in so many seasons well it's also the idea that it's not even like that Ayanna ran long it was that she spent 45 minutes to an hour just going over nonsense Leroy asks a simple question she goes we can have a conversation oneon-one I don't want to take any more people's time because that's disrespecting people's time here and Ace hasn't spoken yet it's like you could have said two names in the SP of a minute and we could have had the question like and I think that's where like his face like that face to me was like the moment where it's like it something snapped in him like I can't believe this like I'm done I'm done with this I listen for 45 minutes I'm confused and she wants to play it off like Leroy you're wasting everybody's time asking a simple question when I've already given my name and enough explanation for like it was just wild and I'm sure there was other stuff that was taken out of like but like how what Kahuna said I mean I don't understand what Ayan is doing in this episode I understand stirring the pot and stirring drama starting drama in the house for strategic purposes or to like move yourself into an alliance or to cause trouble within an alliance that's already set up to break it up this

57:29 Makes no sense just it's almost like I guess for lack of a better term it's like Joker level form of chaos it's just starting chaos just to start chaos people if people instantly know where the information is coming from and not only that you have Ayanna who's in a bad situation with Jasmine coming into this game with Janelle coming into this game and then she's talking with Cam in the kitchen in episode one they're like we're roommates we're going to work together we're going to try to go to the final together and then in the very next episode in the very beginning of the next episode cam is saying well we have this love annoy kind of relationship with each other it's like they knew each other for two days and now Ian is already in the love annoy category with somebody that she just met it's wild it's such a bad gameplay I don't understand it whatsoever and it's kind of crazy let's read it a couple of comments on this there's a few comments that have come in since this all have started so I think I highlighted a couple earlier on this is this was by far the biggest moment so a was so great in episode two oh my God you said Ayana is never more toxic and dangerous than Nicole it's even more toxic and dangerous than Nicole kiwi says a has got in shape and looks good but her attitude stinks

58:50 She was on 10 this week so conflicted about she's good TV but Emoji goofy says I didn't know kefla or Flora but I love them they are awesome also living the for camro return and the mean gos are back this cast all round delivers except for she sucks so yeah more focus on some of the awesome people that have come back I guess then some of the aana drama but it seems like most people here just saying horrible across the board everybody is sort of on that and then this comment is very interesting one where Frank says if it's serious then TJ would give a lecture on the person quitting and it's probably serious because of it because you DJ didn't say well Janelle quit or this is so horrible or anything like that it wasn't much reference made to Janelle leaving the game and I think the biggest difference here when you see people like Leroy and Janelle and that react in the way that they do you've got to remember that these people are not in their like mid 20s anymore I don't want to put up with beer like they're grown as people with like professional careers outside of like the challenge they've got kids they've got families like they're coming back definitely because there's some great money at stake and it's a little bit of that Nostalgia but I think the producers will have to be careful about like you know I know ay probably won't be back in the near-term future

1:00:10 Because of some things that are going on in her personal life but you know there is a line that you have to draw you want to create TV but you also don't want to make it to the point where a lot of other people that we would love to see come back that maybe haven't come back yet look at all star 4 for moments like this and be like yeah I'm kind of past that my life like I don't really want that to be a thing that sort of affects me in my personal life or my professional life outside of the game and I feel like that's why Janelle made that move does that make sense Drew like I feel like is this balance that the producers have to like run because we want to see a bit of the drama we want to see a bit of the fun but when it gets to the point where it got this week with a couple of topics around Ayana and maybe the Nicole stuff that's going on I feel like that could also have like a negative effect and drawing some Talent back into all stars five yeah I think it I think it gets to a point where so we know we know Janelle is very strong and like if it was like based off of a game decisions and stuff like say that she's going up against a big Alliance and she's getting thrown in week after week I think she would stay until she got eliminated or she stayed until she made the final if it's game related I think she would have been able to deal with it but because this went so far beyond the game and so deep into personal stuff that it's like yeah I do have a family back home I do have a good life I am like I think she's a first responder and she's

1:01:30 Like a surgical assistant or she's she does something with surgery it's like oh you're making bank like she doesn't need to deal with this I'm sure the surgery stuff is way more calm than being in a challenge house where she's getting braided halfway through and yeah I just I think it does it will I mean it's happened in the past where it's like Allstar Allstars or like back in the day where it was challenges like if people heard that somebody was going to be on there they would be like go to production say no like after the whole fight with Adam on the Duel 2 apparently CT was slated to be on season 18 the ruins and that word got out to a lot of the cast and a lot of the cast was like I'm not doing it if CT's there so that's why he had to take a couple of Seasons off because allegedly production was like we can't have you on the season until some time has passed and then we can try to introduce you more so I mean we've seen it in the past in as a Invasion like they gave him the backpack as a to see how he is and he impressed them and he wasn't killing anyone so they gave him a season after yeah exactly so I mean it's happened before and yeah for Allstars to be a smaller filming a smaller cast I think people will say like all right I would like to know who's on or you can hear it through

1:02:50 The great finds and then you could see people probably like piecing out or not wanting to do it which is sad yeah so interesting here Lizzy saying I'm 5 minutes behind now just getting to the Janelle situation according to Zack he's got her book next week she so appreciate anyone willing to pay that man money so obviously getting Janelle on like Zack's doing a lot of like he's not getting call backs into the challenge in recent times but he's doing a lot of podcasts with some of the contestants so maybe some more will come out from Janelle side on that lovable Nikki though does say that I fig that no one is saying too much because they need to what is shown in episode 3 I think that we will get much more te next week so I don't know if they will because you know I feel like production probably could be criticized for not handling this situation correctly so they probably will cover it up more than anything else if it is Dei related you know having a Dei sensibility course you know if that is the case shouldn't aana be removed then this is why a lot of people like hate the fact like I'm not in the Big Brother world so much anymore but when you've got big brother playing in these live feeds you can't hide anything so if something happens we had someone removed last season and it's not been the first time that people have been removed for doing things that are racial so yeah it's unfortunate that some of

1:04:10 These things have gone on I wasn't even aware coming into this podcast that was what was going on but it definitely gives me a better understanding of why someone like Janelle would have you know left the game because quit doesn't almost feel right like it sounds like she made the right decision for her in her own mental state to just remove herself from that Circle and it's unfortunate because these games can bring out a different aspect where if it becomes very triable so even if you see someone doing something wrong if you know it's going to jeopard your position in the game to get to $250,000 at the end of it you probably will do things that you shouldn't be doing or cover up for people you shouldn't be covering up and it's not ideal but people are there to win $250,000 they have taken time away from their busy schedules to go play this game so there's a cost associated with that you know like certain people could be working on their bus could be working on things outside of the game so it's not ideal I'm not making excuses for the of the cast but clearly it's a complex situation that we won't know the full story here like it's very hard right Drew yeah I do want to say two things one if you don't have the money to pay for Zach's thing I mean there is Reddit and people do it for Reddit Karma they'll do put a podcast notes I do think that Janelle probably won't say too much or go too much into detail about this one this happened over a year ago not saying that's going to excuse anything or anything

1:05:30 Like that but I just have a feeling like if people are still being so quiet like how many people were in that house 23 people plus alternates and nobody is speaking up just yet like somebody would have jumped at this to say and spill the tea to somebody one of the cast members that are or ex Challengers to say everything so I don't think that I don't think that it will be too much if Janelle is going to be on Zack's podcast as well as I think because Ayanna is going through the recovery and everything I think that it's it could be poor taste to kind of like dump all this stuff and rehash it and kind of make her look really bad as she's going through a really tough time and her family's going through a really tough time like she's already getting a lot of the brunt from everybody because of the edit and everything and I think it just like dumps even more on her if she's going through all the stuff that she is so I just highly doubt that even if Janelle goes and does a podcast next week with Zack that she's just going to be like she said this and she said that she's a terrible person and all this other stuff so I think the timing and everything also plays in into a fact her as well as I think Janelle just wants to like be past it too I think she's been able to get back into her life we're probably never goingon to see her on allst Star again I was surprised

1:06:51 We got to see her after allst Stars too and then after dealing with this I feel like we'll never see her again on the challenge which is very sad but I just feel like she's like put this behind her and she's good to go what I thought J was Janelle in the 40 rumors it could have been maybe at some might be one of the errors in the eror she would she would gladly play with bananas rather than Ayanna wasn't even anywhere close to there no she knows she knows A's not showing up for that's for sure's on 40 I think that means know I'm glad that she obviously was not to the point where she's closed the door completely and that it clearly wasn't enough of a impact on her to keep her away like sheon 40 is massive yeah season 40 is massive like I feel like if there is a show to come like let's be honest like it was kind of funny hearing TJ at the beginning of the episode one say we've kind of created this Multiverse I'm like okay we're heading into the Multiverse of the challenge now but like wouldn't you rather want to play on the flagship show like I feel if you get a call for the flagship show again obviously more time and a lot of people don't have that time to commit to a longer filming schedule but season 40 is kind of going to be a big deal you know like this is this is like the biggest season that they've had on the challenge I feel like anyone

1:08:11 That could make it happen you know would try their best to be on a season such as that because you're going to be seen to be playing with people that are the best from different eras going into that season I do want to move slightly on from this whole situation because we've spent a bit of time on it want to talk about Cam's cheeky strategy gameplay here trying to get Laurel or Nicole to throw themselves in to go up against Tina kuna what was your thoughts on The Cheeky gameplay by cam here trying to you know still like you know play players gonna play while drama's going on Cam's got eyes on the prize trying to get some of the very strong competitors into the arena very early on here yeah each other you guys I don't know how much of it actually was manipulation because I feel like it makes sense like you like Laurel does want to smash her head in get it out of the game get a star you need it at some point like you need to go into the thing like you need to win a star and if it means that you actually have the opportunity because how often are they going to be teamed up where she can actually go against Nicole specifically and like she said if she saw it as a ball if it was ball or Hall brawl or something I think she would have jumped at the chance to be honest with you like I don't think it was

1:09:31 100% manipulation it's clever definitely by cam but there's some Merit to it and it would have had some actual thought behind it had the challenge actually been appropriate for Laura I think she would have loved to get a hands on her like genuinely and maybe in more ways than one going forward who knows yeah I think I think both would have jumped at it I think I think we would have seen like I know Tina isn't a pushover or anything but I think if there was something physical like a pull wrestle or something like that I mean once you heard like you got to remember codes and something to do with your brain I knew Nicole completely shut down it was like ain't no way it sounded too complicated to me in any case it's like what the hell are we doing here like I didn't even know how it was going to play out on the screen like it felt like one of those eliminations where I was going to be like is this maybe it makes sense when you're playing it against each other but is this like the best thing that we can do for TV right now and the first one was kind of underwhelming for me as well like it feels like the last two eliminations have been done on somewhat of a budget to me like you know it doesn't feel like high level at least but yeah I love the idea of the prop makers that had to make these giant video game controllers into a retro thing and then they're like no challenge to like a come on man that work I had to make these bloody controllers I spent all day on

1:10:53 That yeah Paul shout out PA for those that had to get everything set up for this elimination yeah very strange what would have happened do you think Drew if both Nicole and Laurel let's say it's balls in and they're both like we both want to go in do they replace Tina does TJ go well you guys can both come down but Tina is now safe and you're GNA have to go against each other because I don't I don't really feel good for Nicole in that situation going up against Laurel definitely like a height and weight disadvantage for going into a challenge like that yeah I think they would have allowed them both to come down but the decision would have been probably one of them would have played chicken like if it was balls in then it would have been like neither probably Laurel or Nicole want to go up against each other they see Tina down there they want to go up against one of the people that lost in the daily challenge they're looking at that like also Tina I think was in the loser group in the previous EP in episode one as well she was she didn't finish or complete the challenge so it's like okay I would want to go up against them so it's not like ideal that they would both jump down there I'm sure the challenge would be like yeah do it please we would love it but I think it would have came down to them fighting up at the top and then TJ being like hurry up we need a decision you both coming down here like and

1:12:13 Then it would have pushed somebody been like Laurel runs down there and then Nicole just has to sit there and be like do I run down there and then she just like stays up there so I he did ask Laurel first but I think if it did come down to it that both wanted to go down it would have been either both or one has to bow out yeah I think you flagged that one there Darren says cheat codes up down right left right left right start the Konami like G it is up down up down left right left right Darren you got the ba you would you wouldn't have got it up down up down left right left right ba start just so you know if that's a classic cheat code for every Nintendo game and you like get into secret menus and all that sort of thing it's old school probably I'm showing my age there and so is Darren apparently are you across the stre that you know about this cheat code at all like because like it win completely over my head I mean I don't know about the kunami but I know like I used to go on to like games.com and stuff and Simpsons Hit run you open up like unlock cars and stuff and like outfits and stuff and you can get them for free if you put in the actual CoD game Sharks were huge when I was a kid so it's like you don't even need like to

1:13:33 No cheat codes you just put in game shark and yeah this code is so popular it's made it into songs and all that sort like yeah it's see like gr growing up in South Africa we didn't have Nintendo or anything like that we had offshoot we had like the Chinese knockof knockoff versions of it I think it was like called Game Boy or something like that I can't remember it was something completely different and being growing up I was more PC G so I do know about cheat codes like GTA get unlimited money unlimited and stuff like that but it was never like on a controller so completely went over my head apologies for those who are not into gaming at all and are so bored by this conversation right now one thing I'm disappointed not seeing the elimination is if they had actually used that I have a feeling I do know Contra you're setting it up they would have done it yeah Contra I know Contra yeah I definitely remember that from like the TV game like Way Back like was pretty young when that came out yeah so obviously we get Tina here automatically getting a star because no one goes down to take her on and Tina ends up taking Aver star like Drew what was what was that like seeing you know Avery having worked so hard on episode one to get into the top three you know she has one conversation with Tina doesn't take lightly to it you know does her own thing and then Tina comes back and

1:14:53 Like hey I'm going to take your star here very easy in the you it feels kind of like justice for every is kind of what I want to say justice for everyy like she actually worked fortina didn't really work for it fell on a lap yeah I mean that was a huge point of contention in my review and recap and even the comment section video that I put out today on the on the channel because there was some I was very clear that it just doesn't make sense to me that I mean somebody said that why didn't Jasmine have to come down and play we I aled about I mentioned Genesis who was on location as an alternate I mean she was there she was on location she's there to play like even if she's coming in just being thrown to the Lion's Den to play in an elimination it's like she should have been able to come in there and at least like at least if Tina wins she fought and won the star instead of this whole thing of like Laurel you want it Nicole you want it well yeah forfeit you get a star and it's like that kind of like when back in the island where Abram asked people to vote him off and then he just handed his key over to Dunbar and then Dunbar had the key until way late until EV Evelyn took it from him and it's like you didn't earn that it's just it's crazy to me I understand you shouldn't punish Tina

1:16:13 Because that's the rules are the rules but it's just so it was so anticlimactic that whole La episode two I understand why they wanted to do a double header because episode two I felt was anticlimactic ending that if we only had episode one this week only episode two next week it kind of would have been like wow that episode two kind of went a little downhill in my opinion that's how I think that's why they decided to do two episodes but yeah it's not strong enough to stand alone but in with episode one when we get the good feels and the vibes from episode one you can you can let it go we'll move past the end because we had so much drama and stuff in a full double episode release you know mhm we spoke a little bit about I guess the daily for the first one and that was quite physical what did you guys think about the daily for the second one like where they had to get into this Vana and then got spun in the air like it looked like something that I wouldn't want to be taking part in like you must feel so nauseous getting out of that Bloody van and then they've got the radio going on the whole time have to like decipher everything with a code did you like it is this like one of the ones you to get into yeah not that I would necessarily like to get into but I did enjoy the fact that like I like the production

1:17:33 Of it like the show the show of it like we got the spinning van in the air which is what the challenge is great for doing is the spectacle stuff the but the fact that they tied it into it feels like they've got like a they've got like a some sort of promotional quota or deal with Crane Companies each season and they're like have to get a crane in at least like three times the season and make it like they first get the crane sort of and then they think about the challenge that they're going to use kind like yeah we have a crane now let's work backwards from there like yeah let's reverse engineer this challenge yeah like I like that they had the winnter bega to bring up the road rules and the way they did the radio announcements was just fun like you mentioned before playing Grand Theft Auto like the way they were doing the announcements I kept getting that the San Andreas radio like over like 87.2 and like I do besides doing podcasting I do community radio pretty often as well so I like appreciate that and it kind of tickled a part of my brain to have that be TJ Lavin's voice coming up with these promo promos it was fun but it also had like it used a lot like the spinning the having to remember

1:18:54 And then the maths involved it kind of had a lot of aspects to it so I thought it was fun it was a good little Challenge and to have the spectacle the spin spinning van in the air was great yeah shout out to the challenge for like H fisting Leroy getting absolutely decimated in that 30 they showed it like multiple times when he when he quote unquote retired back in 36 as his tribute they showed that and then they couldn't make it a full episode and a half with without showing it here it's like my goodness like they just want to play that moment over and over again it's like can we all relax on that one that was actually legit scary please that was traumatizing man I remember that was like one of the first Seasons I ever watched and I was like that was like one of the first Seasons I over watched and I was like people legitimately get taken out this show it's insane you know compared to like survival where they've taken away any of the physical stuff any of like the contact type of situations but yeah it was interesting they definitely do milk it's kind of like the banana backpack whenever bananas comes back C is on the same season they have to show the banana backpack or you know like it's one of those classic moments but yeah totally agree it was great to see the RV come back as well I didn't really have the road like I said I don't have the road rules sort of background but I remember seeing the first season

1:20:14 Of The Challenge where they also had like the RV in it and they went to New Zealand right like so that was like quite interesting seeing the throwback to that and then seeing that kefla even has the tattoo which is insane like he's like die hard you know when it comes to that but yeah overall very interesting very fun daily challenge and then last thing I wanted to comment on before we get into the point situation because I know Drew you crunched the numbers and you're ready here to talk about the draft and how things are going killer said probably a bit early to get a star in the game for Tina and Avery did mention that so I think that's kind of good that Avery is being seen as the smarter person in the this situation like yeah she's got the star but is it really the move right now so if you read into edits I feel like it means Avery probably has longer legs in the game compared to or like she'll go deeper probably compared to Tina at this point just based on an edit based on one little clip could totally be wrong still on that but very interesting and I do agree having that Target so early on it's actually one of the things I think is going to make it interesting to watch how K Maria deals with that pressure so early on because you know and I like the fact that they didn't tell them about the stars and the fact that they're going to have a bounty on their head before they finish that challenge because I think a lot of people would have GED it probably tried to not get into first place or kind of be middle

1:21:34 Of the pack so I really like the way that they did that I thought that was quite smart by the production team any final thoughts from either of you two anything you felt like you wanted to discuss before we head into the draft points what do you think of the actual format of taking the Stars like I appreciate that there's a limited number not just unlimited skulls like there's we know that's good but I'm trying to think like if you get to the like say for example Avery right I'm just gaming out of a weird scenario she got her star stolen in like what we're saying is a really bad way like not earning it at all Tina's got her Star right everyone she's now not got it if she wants to get it back she has to win a daily to then throw herself into an elimination then win an elimination to then get it and the way she could do this on repeat she could do this in the or come last and get voted in though right but no one will vote the really good competitor back in to get a star so it's like the problem the problem the problem that I have with this twist it's similar to the skulls twist is that we know that they will not follow through on it like they will go to the final six no one is no one who doesn't have a star is going to get eliminated from the game unless I'm wrong I could be wrong they haven't done it yet they always threatened they're always like oh you got to get the

1:22:55 You got to get the star but there's enough rounds for people to jump in the last round and get a star so they can go to the final so to me they just doesn't feel consequences to not having a star there's no consequences in my mind I'm hoping they I'm with I'm with Kahuna that I don't know how I feel about this so far like at least with the skull twist we didn't know how many skulls there were going to be or many episodes there were going to be we know that there's 12 episodes on this one there's probably going to be like maybe a purge we're probably going to have a double elimination here there but we have this is like the one thing that like we're we know a set number we know a set number of stars that are in the thing but yeah it just seems like there's so there's such a roundabout way of having to go just even have an opportunity to get your star back it's almost like yeah it's almost like terrible to have your star this early in the in this show unless I to me for the women's side I think nobody wants to mess with Cara or Rachel and I think that one star that was Aver's now Tina's is gonna bounce around to a whole bunch of people but what if like KY and Rachel right they're scary or what if like I said if Avery

1:24:15 Has does this cyc and repeat and gets back and works to ass off and has the amaz the best season we've ever seen and then on the final women's elimination you get star stolen there's no chance to get it back anymore like I star like you need like if I earn the star I want to be able to defend it you can't just take it and I have no opportunity to do anything about it is weird to me like I agree I reckon I reckon they should to get a star you should call down the star like you know call the star down take Star by beating me not by just beating some Rando you beat you beat no one and you take my star like I was going to say you beat she Lally beat no one and not just that you can have Leroy beat someone an elimination and then you know Tina could lose the Star by Leroy taking it and giving it to cam like so it does I don't know in theory it's an interesting concept I don't know how I feel about it and then the last part of it is I don't know if it's actually going to have any consequences or if it's going to be like the skull twist where production will not actually Purge anyone who doesn't have it like production may decide we'll just go long enough until everybody has an opportunity to get a start which is what they've done with the skull twist every time they've done it which is why the skull twist to me who cares like it's just a gimmic it's not it doesn't have consequences so it's going to be interesting I mean we

1:25:36 We'll probably have to review it by the end of the season I think all of us are on the same page we're like sounds like it could be a fun and interesting idea but let's see how it plays out throughout the season it's kind of where I'm sitting on it yeah I'm optimistic yeah was there anything else you wanted to bring up as well Drew in regards to the season before we sort of head towards the draft no I mean we don't even have to talk about the draft if you don't want to I'm just I think listen I think we got you all dressed up for the podcast you know like you made sure to jump on here at least we got to give the people what they want they want to know where are we sitting on the draft right now you know what does the points look like my one last thing episod that I didn't realize how much I missed and appreciate the fact that grown adults are allowed to swear oh yeah and see TV so I feel like maybe Drew might the way he's feeling right now is it something that you want to swear about drew the points I just want to throw it out there that I am last place in both drafts by a pretty wide margin so the original draft I don't have up on the screen right now you could probably talk through that one really quickly that's the one that we all did like a year ago before these people we just knew the cast They didn't even start the season

1:26:56 Yet and then this one was closer to the end so maybe if you want to talk through the original one just at a very high level and then we'll get into this one I guess yeah I can do it real quickly in third place is me with 62 total points I lost Janelle so I am down to only seven players so remember I have 62 points in second place is Chris with 82 points yeah that's right I'm down 20 points already after two episodes and you have everybody still you have and by the way that's the one that really matters to me because I've got K Maria as my first pick and that se that's the one in my heart that truly matters right oh you crushed it you had Brad and Cara as your top two picks so and they were the first the first place in the first episode and then Chantel is in first place although she lost Tyrie she's in first place with 103 points wow there's 20 point difference between all of us it's kind of nuts yeah that's wild actually is this one more competitive the one with Kahuna as well yeah I would say so because taking it back to our quad I am in fourth place last place if people want a clarification with 51 total points

1:28:16 Which is great love it still have all of your cast members at least by full everybody yeah everybody the only person that lost somebody was Shantel because she lost Janelle which the crowd lost Janelle by the way everybody Chantel is like the sidecar person in this motorcycle and you the chat lost Janelle that was your decision just remember that you have to live with that the consequences third place is Kahuna with 53 total points you're only two points ahead of me out of last place so fourth is me Guna is third Chris oh no Chantel is second with 57 total points and she lost Chanelle so hey we're getting close I mean 51 53 57 well guess what Chris you're in first place with 77 total points you're 20 points ahead of all of us his points yeah I took all those Nicole drama points like I said I feel good about it you have four people in double digits I think only has two people in double digits I have three people barely in double digits and kuna has three people barely in double digits but you have Tina with 18 points Nicole with 17

1:29:37 Points and Leroy and Jay both having 13 Points each as well as Jasmine and Adam both having eight points each so I mean your team is rocket just rocketing and everybody else is around 50 57 trying to Vive for second place at this point yeah it's listen it's going to be it's a long season where just in the we're just in the start of this thing and like Chris said no not a single mention of Jay because we know Chris is like hyper focused on the biceps of Jay coming into this season who wouldn't be I mean but the guy's coming in he's got he's got a point to prove you know he didn't get much content though he did not get much content I feel like throughout the first couple of episodes but clearly that Underdog Story is going to be a big part of how he does this season like saying like so many people don't remember him for the fact that he never came in last and he did really well in the dailies but it was only the fact that he couldn't finish the eating challenge in the final so I'm interested I'm interested to see I feel like the seeds have been planted there Chris saying J gang rise up Lena saying looks like Chad did well choosing Chantel's draft she is in second oh Lena firing shots back at you drew saying that we've done a good job so have them apples

1:30:57 Yeah I suck Christina saying who ever voted for Chantel Loki hosed her and then Den saying I don't think Drew has much drama in his team yeah I went for all drama and it's going to be interesting for those who are not aware kuna's undefeated in a draft like he's never lost a draft he went back toback with and Survivor slow start for him in this season but I do think you've got some really strong potential know prospects there I think 100% And then Drew's the Drew's the all stars like Guru when it comes to drafts like I don't think You' have you ever lost an all star draft like I feel like that's been your jam Drew not since we like started like when I was able to do season two yeah because Season Two Season three I won both pretty handedly I also won 38 pretty well I think I've won one other one but yeah I haven't lost an Allstars one and normally it's my bread and butter normally I know what to do but this season I mean picking this a year ahead of time and then doing a quad draft and it just everything's going up and down and wild and crazy so yeah sounds major it's tough it's tough I feel like I'm Gonna Keep on losing it's not looking

1:32:17 Good one of my worst seasons I had one of my worst seasons for both USA and USA 2 and then I had a pretty bad season for 39 and when I say pretty bad I mean I had one person left on both USA one and two and 39 as go heading into the final so it's I have a case of The Yips I love I love the match up this season because we've got Kahuna we've got Kahuna's never lost a draft you've got you who've you've basically won all of the allstars draft so obviously there's some momentum at least from that aspect because you know some of the past players better than most of like definitely better than me and then I've just won two in a row so I'm coming in with momentum so there's so many great matchups coming into this draft that it's going to be interesting like someone is going to get disappointed somewhere and then chantella is the True Underdog Story she is the People's Choice coming into this draft they've chosen for her because you know she hasn't won a draft since all stars won so she really is trying to get back into and that was only me and her who did that draft so since we've been doing it as a deal I don't think she's won a draft so if she does win this one I feel you know there's going to have to be like some real acknowledgement that the people got her across the line you know like that she needed to call in the backup of the live audience to get her there like is it truly her win if the

1:33:37 People gave her that win kuna is what I'm trying to ask you know like is it is it the people's win or is it Chantel's win you know we need to know these things some people can do this and some people need help is so you know just wait until she wins both she wins the trio draft and the quad draft and yeah that's going to be like when whether it's her not I mean she's the Figure Head she has the name on the title so I mean if she's sitting there with two belts at the end of this I will be even more impressed than anything ever listen we need to remember this right she came she went onto her podcast to talk about the DFT afterwards and be like they set me up they clearly don't want me to win this so if she does win it does it prove that Chantel's Read's completely off and the people's read is actually more on it because they knew better than Chantel coming into the season I love it's like there's this like you know LoveHate relationship between her and the people who chose her team for her this season so I'm kind of invested if I'm not winning it I kind of want Chantel to win it so I can be like Chantel you remember that time when you said that the people didn't know what they were doing when they chose your team I feel like you need we need a public apology for this if she does win this season but yeah listen what a great time having both of you on here

1:34:57 It's been so good to talk about the premiere episode episodes I should say for the challenge if everybody in the live really enjoyed it if you're new to the channel it's the first time you've come across it please consider subscribing and putting a like on the video putting the notification Bell on that way you get informed the next time that we do go live and the more people we have following the channel like I'd love to get like I'm interviewing a lot of Australian survivors right now in the future I'd love to have even Challengers come on to the so we can talk to them like you know so obviously getting people subscribing to the channel helps with credibility because a lot of people do in this superficial social media world that we that we live in everybody looks at the numbers first and they're like oh he's only got like so many subscribers so continue to support please in that way it's completely free to do so and before we shut off here angel cake has got the final say angel cake what is happening on your channel what should people be aware of what is coming in the next couple of weeks well I just put out three videos this past week so this upcoming week for the channel is going to be pretty light it's going to be some promo stuff for the patreon as well as some shorts and then the review and recap I'm hoping to get a what if video done that I'm going to be going deep diving into like a specific point of the challenge and if a butterfly effect happened I want to do that I know I have another

1:36:18 Hot takes video I'd like to get done but what's coming out this upcoming week is I'm working on a Traders us season CT trell and bananas basically the whole game breakdown of diving into that season and how the winners won that season and I'm G be posting that it's probably gonna be an hour long and I'm gonna be posting that on patreon my patreon earlier in the week hopefully and then some other content that I'll also be working on so yeah it's just a lot of fun stuff I want to I want to just do a lot of fun stuff I did a 10-year retrospective on free agents which just turned 10 this past Wednesday when Allstars 4 premiered 10 years ago in 2014 free agents premiered season 25 wow and I wanted to go back and like see how everything went and how it changed the trajectory of the game and I really had a fun time putting that video together it's up now on the channel and I put it up on this past Monday and it was really fun it made me want to do like more stuff like that so I'm looking forward to doing more in-depth historical stuff and just some fun things Al together yeah amazing go check out angel cake entertainment on YouTube trust me you're not going to be disappointed this guy works around the clock to put great content out there for challenge fans looking forward to

1:37:38 Seeing what the traits What thoughts you have on Traders as well that should be very interesting as well and you know if you do join the patreon it's great community on Discord that talk about all things reality TV related not just the challenge and it really is a great community everybody in the live thank you so much we really appreciate your great insights your questions taking part in the conversation it's been great we will catch you next week for episode three see you bye